dragaerafandomcom-20200214-history
Talk:Cawti
Are there any indcations of Cawti's age? Presumably she's not noticably much older than Vlad, or he would have mentioned it, but if she is Brigitta's kid, she might be naturally long-lived. We know from Brimford's example that witches can live for a very long time. -Rook None of the Vlad books weigh in on anything other than her apparent age. According to the Timeline by Alexx, she's the exact same age as Vlad, but again, this is based on the logic that they got married, so they "must therefore be about the same age". Keep in mind, the idea that she's Bragitta's kid is pure speculation. It's possible that Brigitta's kid is someone else "important". (Vlad's mother? His Grandmother Ibronka? Etc) and that all of the assumptions about the dates of the time period of Brokedown Palace are off by a number of years simply because they assume Cawti is Brigitta and Miklos' kid. (I do still consider Cawti the likiest candidate, mind you, I'm just saying we don't really have any solid facts on any of this.) --Majikjon 21:55, 20 Oct 2005 (UTC) It should also be pointed out that sorcerers can also extend their lives (as Sandor did)... This might help explain Brimford, Miska, and a number of other Easterners that we see living for several hundreds of years. --Majikjon 21:58, 20 Oct 2005 (UTC) --- Just wanted to point out that SKZB has said in more than one location that Cawti is Brigitta's daughter. Other mentions were second-hand, but here is one by Himself. Now, this may not be considered confirmed (in the same way that Devera's father being Kieron is not absolute, since SKZB has only stated it in interviews and mailing-lists and such, but nowhere in the books themselves), but it does exist as an at least semi-canonical statement. --Davdi 00:16, 21 Oct 2005 (UTC) --- Vlad is not related to Brigitta's daughter, if we believe Verra. Verra says Vlad's of peasant stock, and the daughter would have royal blood. --- True. However, the Fenerian royal family itself is of "peasant stock"... (If you believe the interludes in Brokedown Palace, anyway.) And Brigitta is certainly peasant stock (at least on her mother's side). What's more clearly stated is that Verra says that Miklos is NOT one of Vlad's ancestors. Pretty clearly rules that out... But it wouldn't be the first time that Verra has lied to Vlad, should Steve change his mind about how things should work out. --Majikjon 14:10, 23 Oct 2005 (UTC) --- I'm not sure I quite understand your first paragraph - sure, the royal family may have intermarried with members of the lower classes, but there does seem to be an aristocracy (such as the various Counts mentioned), and the Fenarian royal family seems to have been largely continuous. Generally speaking, if "peasants" have been ruling long enough, then those peasants are the royal blood. I assume that what Verra meant was that none of Vlad's ancestors had been of the aristocracy; that they had always been peasants, workers of the land. Of course, that may be less pejorative than it sounds. After all, Noish-pa was a peasant, or maybe rather the son of a peasant. Yet he certainly has his own inner nobility. And getting back to Cawti, she may be Miklós' daughter (and therefore of "royal blood"), but that doesn't put her in line for the throne of Fenario. She is, to use the technical term in its most literal sense, a bastard. And of a younger prince, too; not even of the King. And, given that Fenario seems to have a highly patriarchical inheritance system, a female. And, for that matter, living in Faerie for her entire life. I'd be willing to bet that if for some reason the question ever arose, that there are far better qualified members of the Fenarian nobility than Cawti to take the throne of Fenario, assuming she would even have interest in such a thing, which I'm pretty sure she wouldn't. --Davdi 21:38, 23 Oct 2005 (UTC) -- All of what you say about intermarriage of peasantry and "royal blood" is true. But it still leaves enough wiggle room for Verra's statements about "peasant stock" to be literally true--and still be extremely misleading (something she's very good at). Let me just say again for the record, I'm not espousing this as a likely theory. Just one of many unknown possibilities. Verra seems quite clear that Vlad is NOT related to Miklos. So, unless she's lying for some reason, (which I can see no reason for) then that is that. (Of course, If Cawti is Brigitta's daughter, then Vlad IS technically related to Miklos--he's his father-in-law. So Verra's statement is at the very least incomplete, bordering on misleading.) As to Cawti ever inheriting anything, I don't believe that ever came up (until you mentioned it, that is). Of course Cawti (if Briggita's daughter, as seems likely) wouldn't inherit anything. My guess is that Mariska and Vilmos get together later, and their son becomes the next King of Fenario... Or maybe that's too neat a package. Who can say? --Majikjon 22:35, 23 Oct 2005 (UTC) --- While I'm not inclined to fiddle too much with the friends/associates distinction, I would argue that if someone visits Sethra Lavode frequently, and isn't trying to get something from her (like a high-level magic user trying to get tips and tricks, or a soldier trying to get military aid, or a historian trying to get firsthand info on long-past events of the Empire)(and note that even Paarfi corresponded with her rather than visited her), then that person should be considered a friend. Dzur Mountain is Sethra's home, and she's not wildly gregarious. Indeed, Sethra is such a private individual that allowing someone to visit her stronghold multiple times is probably the best sign of friendship that there is, I nearly think. --Davdi 18:45, 7 September 2006 (UTC) ::Well, my thinking goes like thsi: We don't really know the reasons, or number of times, that Cawti has visited Dzur Mountain. Nor why she did so. Perhaps she's become friends with Tukko? Or maybe her friend Kiera hangs out there a lot of the time? Even if she was going there to visit Sethra (not an unreasonable assumption, I'll grant you), we still don't have anything more than circumstantial evidence that it was out of friendship. Maybe Cawti was trying to get Sethra's help in fighting the Jhereg in South Adrilankha? Perhaps Sethra wanted to visit with Vlad Norathar out of friendship with Vlad that does not extend all the way to Cawti? I'm not trying to say that Cawti and Sethra are not friends, just that, as with Aliera, we can't be all that sure about how things stand... We just don't have enough information. --Majikjon 20:36, 7 September 2006 (UTC) Sword and Dagger "The partners were known as the Sword and the Dagger (Cawti was the "The Dagger of the Jhereg"), in reference to their respective heights." Is this true? I always thought it was a reference to their weapons, Norathar using a sword and Cawti using daggers. :Good point, and I reworded this, after moving it to the Sword and the Dagger article, where it seemed more appropriate. :--Davdi 18:30, 11 October 2006 (UTC)